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Hello to the group.
I have beenlurking here for awhile, as I do in a dozen or so radio related groups. Just as a matter of perspective, I built my first crystal set in 1958. I have somewhere around 40 radios and maybe a dozen of them are ultra light class radios.
I recently purchased a PL 310 and honestly have been pretty happy with the performance. Then I started reading about Gary's experiments with improved loopsticks for the 310 and 380. This got me to thinking about doing some experimanting of my own.
The problem is that I have not wound a coil in years and even then did not use litz wire now have access to the modern materials that we have today.
I have a few questions concerning the mod that Gary did for the stock PL 310 loopstick, and coil winding in geneeral. For the 310, I wonder what the material was that Gary used to wrap the ferrite rod before winding the wire. I had read (and BTW, I spent several hours searching on coil winding techniques) that a masking tape could be used with the sticky side out to hold the windings in place. This sounds good, but would seem to present some problems with keeping the tape tight on the bar and making a uniform base. The pictures of Gary's loopstick, on the stock bar, for the 310 seemed to show a different material. What is a good material to wrap the ferrite with before winding the coil to get a good even base that will stay put on the rod? I have some heat shrink tubing that would fit, but worry about the thickness effecting inductance.
As to the wire itself, how do people retain it when starting the winding process, and when it is finished? I would guess that a tightly wound coil will stay put, but holding the initial end in place when starting and the final end when finished would be required. I thought about hot glue, but was concerned about electrical effects.
What is the prefered method of holding the rod so that the wire can be easily and uniformly wound?
If anyone could provide some tips to help me get started and covering what I have asked, or anything that I have missed, or point me to a good resource, I would greatly appreciate it.
Thanks,
Phil Pasteur
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Gary DeBock
Hello Phil,
Welcome to the group, and thanks for your interest in the coil winding
technique used here in the PL-310 loopstick experimentation.
In answer to your question about the type of tape used to hold the Litz
wire turns in place, I use Johnson & Johnson waterproof 2" wide tape,
as pictured in the photo below.
This tape is wide enough to cut a piece slightly longer than the length of
the planned coil, then wrap in an overlapping pattern on a half inch diameter
ferrite bar, with the adhesive side out. In the photo above, this tape was used
as the form for construction of an E100 Slider coil, with a half inch
router bit shank used as a temporary base (assisted by a thin strip of a plastic
credit card, to ensure that the coil was not wound too tightly). After winding,
the strip of credit card was pulled out, providing a Slider coil that was "not
too loose, but not too tight."
This waterproofing tape is excellent for holding the coil turns on
experimental loopsticks, and was purchased from http://www.medicalsupply.com about 2
years ago, when I was able to get a lifetime supply. If you have trouble
tracking it down, let me know, and I may be able to send you a small supply to
meet your needs.
73 and Best Wishes,
Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA)
In a message dated 12/27/2009 10:35:06 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
ppasteur@q.com writes:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hello to the group.
I have beenlurking here for awhile, as I do in a
dozen or so radio related groups. Just as a matter of perspective, I built my
first crystal set in 1958. I have somewhere around 40 radios and maybe a dozen
of them are ultra light class radios.
I recently purchased a PL 310 and
honestly have been pretty happy with the performance. Then I started reading
about Gary's experiments with improved loopsticks for the 310 and 380. This
got me to thinking about doing some experimanting of my own.
The
problem is that I have not wound a coil in years and even then did not use
litz wire now have access to the modern materials that we have today.
I
have a few questions concerning the mod that Gary did for the stock PL 310
loopstick, and coil winding in geneeral. For the 310, I wonder what the
material was that Gary used to wrap the ferrite rod before winding the wire. I
had read (and BTW, I spent several hours searching on coil winding techniques)
that a masking tape could be used with the sticky side out to hold the
windings in place. This sounds good, but would seem to present some problems
with keeping the tape tight on the bar and making a uniform base. The pictures
of Gary's loopstick, on the stock bar, for the 310 seemed to show a different
material. What is a good material to wrap the ferrite with before winding the
coil to get a good even base that will stay put on the rod? I have some heat
shrink tubing that would fit, but worry about the thickness effecting
inductance.
As to the wire itself, how do people retain it when
starting the winding process, and when it is finished? I would guess that a
tightly wound coil will stay put, but holding the initial end in place when
starting and the final end when finished would be required. I thought about
hot glue, but was concerned about electrical effects.
What is the
prefered method of holding the rod so that the wire can be easily and
uniformly wound?
If anyone could provide some tips to help me get
started and covering what I have asked, or anything that I have missed, or
point me to a good resource, I would greatly appreciate
it.
Thanks,
Phil Pasteur
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Gary DeBock
Hi Phil,
Sorry that the photo (of the Johnson & Johnson 2" wide waterproof tape)
didn't come through in the email. The same photo is in the Ultralightdx Photo
section (in the "Loopstick Lunacy" album), titled "Winding the Slider
Coil."
After receiving the emails from you and Gregory Mosher concerning the
challenge of winding the optimum coils for the PL-310 and PL-380, I
was reminded of my own early efforts to find suitable coil forms and tape. The
wrong kind of adhesive tape can really mess up a loopstick project, causing hand
capacitance and other issues. The Johnson & Johnson 2" wide waterproof
tape has been thoroughly tested in both sliding-coil and fixed-coil loopsticks,
and performs very well in both situations. Please don't hesitate to ask for
some, if you have trouble ordering it from http://www.medicalsupply.com (whose
web site reminds me of a puzzle game).
For the PL-310 and PL-380 upgrade loopsticks, a fixed-coil system should
work fine. Just wrap the tape in an overlapping fashion, wind the recommended
number of 40/44 Litz wire turns on the tape, and solder the new coil
leads into place on the circuit board (replacing the stock loopstick
leads).
73, Gary DeBock
In a message dated 12/29/2009 6:14:03 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
ppasteur@q.com writes:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Gary,
Thanks for the reply!
Unfortunately the photo in your message
did not make it through.
I think I understand that you apply the tape with
the adhesive side out and overlap the ends enough to that it stays put. I
think for the upgrade to the stock ferrite I could just wind the wire onto the
ape applied directly to the ferrite, as I will not need to slide it. Is this
correct?
I will check into finding some of the tape that you mention.
Hopefully I can find some. If not, I may well take you up on your kind
offer.
If anyone else has any suggestions on coil construction, I would
like to hear them.
Thanks again Gary,
Phil Pasteur
--- In
ultralightdx@yahoogroups.com,
D1028Gary@... wrote:
>
> Hello Phil,
>
> Welcome
to the group, and thanks for your interest in the coil winding te
>
chnique used here in the PL-310 loopstick experimentation.
>
> In
answer to your question about the type of tape used to hold the Litz
>
wire turns in place, I use Johnson & Johnson waterproof 2" wide tape, as
> pictured in the photo below.
>
>
>
>
> This tape is wide enough to cut a piece slightly longer than the
length of
> the planned coil, then wrap in an overlapping pattern on a
half inch
> diameter ferrite bar, with the adhesive side out. In the
photo above, this tape
> was used as the form for construction of an
E100 Slider coil, with a half
> inch router bit shank used as a
temporary base (assisted by a thin strip of a
> plastic credit card, to
ensure that the coil was not wound too tightly).
> After winding, the
strip of credit card was pulled out, providing a Slider
> coil that was
"not too loose, but not too tight."
>
> This waterproofing tape
is excellent for holding the coil turns on
> experimental loopsticks,
and was purchased from _http://www.medicalsupply.com_
> (http://www.medicalsupply.com)
about 2 years ago, when I was able to get a
> lifetime supply. If you
have trouble tracking it down, let me know, and I may
> be able to send
you a small supply to meet your needs.
>
> 73 and Best
Wishes,
>
> Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA)
>
>
>
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Gary DeBock
Phil,
After again running through the maze of the Medical Supply.com web sire, I
did come up with this link for anyone wishing to order the Johnson & Johnson
2" wide waterproof tape (for wrapping loopstick coils).
Unfortunately the minimum order (at $42.00) provides six rolls at 10 yards
each, or more than enough tape to make about 1,000 loopstick coils. Unless you
work as a doctor for an NFL football team with serious issues (like the Seattle
Seahawks), you may wish to pass on this one.
73, Gary
In a message dated 12/29/2009 6:14:03 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
ppasteur@q.com writes:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Gary,
Thanks for the reply!
Unfortunately the photo in your message
did not make it through.
I think I understand that you apply the tape with
the adhesive side out and overlap the ends enough to that it stays put. I
think for the upgrade to the stock ferrite I could just wind the wire onto the
ape applied directly to the ferrite, as I will not need to slide it. Is this
correct?
I will check into finding some of the tape that you mention.
Hopefully I can find some. If not, I may well take you up on your kind
offer.
If anyone else has any suggestions on coil construction, I would
like to hear them.
Thanks again Gary,
Phil Pasteur
--- In
ultralightdx@yahoogroups.com,
D1028Gary@... wrote:
>
> Hello Phil,
>
> Welcome
to the group, and thanks for your interest in the coil winding te
>
chnique used here in the PL-310 loopstick experimentation.
>
> In
answer to your question about the type of tape used to hold the Litz
>
wire turns in place, I use Johnson & Johnson waterproof 2" wide tape, as
> pictured in the photo below.
>
>
>
>
> This tape is wide enough to cut a piece slightly longer than the
length of
> the planned coil, then wrap in an overlapping pattern on a
half inch
> diameter ferrite bar, with the adhesive side out. In the
photo above, this tape
> was used as the form for construction of an
E100 Slider coil, with a half
> inch router bit shank used as a
temporary base (assisted by a thin strip of a
> plastic credit card, to
ensure that the coil was not wound too tightly).
> After winding, the
strip of credit card was pulled out, providing a Slider
> coil that was
"not too loose, but not too tight."
>
> This waterproofing tape
is excellent for holding the coil turns on
> experimental loopsticks,
and was purchased from _http://www.medicalsupply.com_
> (http://www.medicalsupply.com)
about 2 years ago, when I was able to get a
> lifetime supply. If you
have trouble tracking it down, let me know, and I may
> be able to send
you a small supply to meet your needs.
>
> 73 and Best
Wishes,
>
> Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA)
>
>
>
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Gary,
Thanks for the reply!
Unfortunately the photo in your message did not make it through.
I think I understand that you apply the tape with the adhesive side out and overlap the ends enough to that it stays put. I think for the upgrade to the stock ferrite I could just wind the wire onto the ape applied directly to the ferrite, as I will not need to slide it. Is this correct?
I will check into finding some of the tape that you mention.
Hopefully I can find some. If not, I may well take you up on your kind offer.
If anyone else has any suggestions on coil construction, I would like to hear them.
Thanks again Gary,
Phil Pasteur
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In ultralightdx@..., D1028Gary@... wrote:
Hello Phil,
Welcome to the group, and thanks for your interest in the coil winding te
chnique used here in the PL-310 loopstick experimentation.
In answer to your question about the type of tape used to hold the Litz
wire turns in place, I use Johnson & Johnson waterproof 2" wide tape, as
pictured in the photo below.
This tape is wide enough to cut a piece slightly longer than the length of
the planned coil, then wrap in an overlapping pattern on a half inch
diameter ferrite bar, with the adhesive side out. In the photo above, this tape
was used as the form for construction of an E100 Slider coil, with a half
inch router bit shank used as a temporary base (assisted by a thin strip of a
plastic credit card, to ensure that the coil was not wound too tightly).
After winding, the strip of credit card was pulled out, providing a Slider
coil that was "not too loose, but not too tight."
This waterproofing tape is excellent for holding the coil turns on
experimental loopsticks, and was purchased from _http://www.medicalsupply.com_
(http://www.medicalsupply.com) about 2 years ago, when I was able to get a
lifetime supply. If you have trouble tracking it down, let me know, and I may
be able to send you a small supply to meet your needs.
73 and Best Wishes,
Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA)
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All,
This similar Amazon link is a little less expensive
at $23 plus shipping for 6 rolls @ 2"x2.5 yds:
Jim Shaw
AL7BA
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, December 29, 2009 10:26
PM
Subject: Re: [ultralightdx] Re: Coil
Winding Advice
Phil,
After again running through the maze of the Medical Supply.com web sire,
I did come up with this link for anyone wishing to order the Johnson &
Johnson 2" wide waterproof tape (for wrapping loopstick coils).
Unfortunately the minimum order (at $42.00) provides six rolls at 10
yards each, or more than enough tape to make about 1,000 loopstick coils.
Unless you work as a doctor for an NFL football team with serious issues (like
the Seattle Seahawks), you may wish to pass on this one.
73, Gary
In a message dated 12/29/2009 6:14:03 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,
ppasteur@q.com writes:
Gary,
Thanks for the reply!
Unfortunately the photo in your message
did not make it through.
I think I understand that you apply the tape
with the adhesive side out and overlap the ends enough to that it stays put.
I think for the upgrade to the stock ferrite I could just wind the wire onto
the ape applied directly to the ferrite, as I will not need to slide it. Is
this correct?
I will check into finding some of the tape that you
mention.
Hopefully I can find some. If not, I may well take you up
on your kind offer.
If anyone else has any suggestions on coil
construction, I would like to hear them.
Thanks again
Gary,
Phil Pasteur
--- In ultralightdx@yahoogroups.com,
D1028Gary@... wrote:
>
> Hello Phil,
>
>
Welcome to the group, and thanks for your interest in the coil winding
te
> chnique used here in the PL-310 loopstick
experimentation.
>
> In answer to your question about the type
of tape used to hold the Litz
> wire turns in place, I use Johnson
& Johnson waterproof 2" wide tape, as
> pictured in the photo
below.
>
>
>
>
> This tape is wide enough
to cut a piece slightly longer than the length of
> the planned coil,
then wrap in an overlapping pattern on a half inch
> diameter ferrite
bar, with the adhesive side out. In the photo above, this tape
> was
used as the form for construction of an E100 Slider coil, with a half
> inch router bit shank used as a temporary base (assisted by a thin
strip of a
> plastic credit card, to ensure that the coil was not
wound too tightly).
> After winding, the strip of credit card was
pulled out, providing a Slider
> coil that was "not too loose, but
not too tight."
>
> This waterproofing tape is excellent for
holding the coil turns on
> experimental loopsticks, and was
purchased from _http://www.medicalsupply.com_
> (http://www.medicalsupply.com)
about 2 years ago, when I was able to get a
> lifetime supply. If you
have trouble tracking it down, let me know, and I may
> be able to
send you a small supply to meet your needs.
>
> 73 and Best
Wishes,
>
> Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA)
>
>
>
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Some more possible sources for the tape-
Any drug store which carries products from that company may be able to order it by the item or stock number, and have it added to there next shipment. Just see if they have that brand on the shelf before you ask.
Near most hospitals in my area there is a 'Medical' or 'Surgical' pharmacy which carries a big supply of dressings and tape for patients who have just been discharged, and still have bandaging. They might have it on the shelf.
One of the Walmarts in my area did have a huge section like that too, so it's worth looking or asking at a Walmart pharmacy.
There are Fire/Police/EMS Supply houses in my area which sell all the stuff to restock first aide kits, so they might have it.
How many people would want it? If enough were interested, I could look for a bunch of it, and mail out individual rolls, if nobody can find it locally.- FARMERIK
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
--- In ultralightdx@..., "Jim Shaw" <jshaw1@...> wrote:
All,
This similar Amazon link is a little less expensive at $23 plus shipping for 6 rolls @ 2"x2.5 yds:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000GCOI1O/ref=asc_df_B000GCOI1O993990?smid=A2UILHLLDUMCAM&tag=shopzilla_mp_1030-20&linkCode=asn&creative=380341&creativeASIN=B000GCOI1O
Jim Shaw
AL7BA
----- Original Message -----
From: D1028Gary@...
To: ultralightdx@...
Sent: Tuesday, December 29, 2009 10:26 PM
Subject: Re: [ultralightdx] Re: Coil Winding Advice
Phil,
After again running through the maze of the Medical Supply.com web sire, I did come up with this link for anyone wishing to order the Johnson & Johnson 2" wide waterproof tape (for wrapping loopstick coils).
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0015XOCO6/ref=asc_df_B0015XOCO6993990?smid=A367RFIQRDER75&tag=shopzilla_mp_1030-20&linkCode=asn&creative=380341&creativeASIN=B0015XOCO6
Unfortunately the minimum order (at $42.00) provides six rolls at 10 yards each, or more than enough tape to make about 1,000 loopstick coils. Unless you work as a doctor for an NFL football team with serious issues (like the Seattle Seahawks), you may wish to pass on this one.
73, Gary
In a message dated 12/29/2009 6:14:03 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, ppasteur@... writes:
Gary,
Thanks for the reply!
Unfortunately the photo in your message did not make it through.
I think I understand that you apply the tape with the adhesive side out and overlap the ends enough to that it stays put. I think for the upgrade to the stock ferrite I could just wind the wire onto the ape applied directly to the ferrite, as I will not need to slide it. Is this correct?
I will check into finding some of the tape that you mention.
Hopefully I can find some. If not, I may well take you up on your kind offer.
If anyone else has any suggestions on coil construction, I would like to hear them.
Thanks again Gary,
Phil Pasteur
--- In ultralightdx@..., D1028Gary@ wrote:
>
> Hello Phil,
>
> Welcome to the group, and thanks for your interest in the coil winding te
> chnique used here in the PL-310 loopstick experimentation.
>
> In answer to your question about the type of tape used to hold the Litz
> wire turns in place, I use Johnson & Johnson waterproof 2" wide tape, as
> pictured in the photo below.
>
>
>
>
> This tape is wide enough to cut a piece slightly longer than the length of
> the planned coil, then wrap in an overlapping pattern on a half inch
> diameter ferrite bar, with the adhesive side out. In the photo above, this tape
> was used as the form for construction of an E100 Slider coil, with a half
> inch router bit shank used as a temporary base (assisted by a thin strip of a
> plastic credit card, to ensure that the coil was not wound too tightly).
> After winding, the strip of credit card was pulled out, providing a Slider
> coil that was "not too loose, but not too tight."
>
> This waterproofing tape is excellent for holding the coil turns on
> experimental loopsticks, and was purchased from _http://www.medicalsupply.com_
> (http://www.medicalsupply.com) about 2 years ago, when I was able to get a
> lifetime supply. If you have trouble tracking it down, let me know, and I may
> be able to send you a small supply to meet your needs.
>
> 73 and Best Wishes,
>
> Gary DeBock (in Puyallup, WA)
>
>
>
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--- In ultralightdx@..., "farmerik" <farmerik@...> wrote:
Some more possible sources for the tape-
It's interesting that Roy got such good results, and no report of hand-capacitance problems, using wire-wrap wire wound close to the core, without this expensive tape. Any theories? Someone recently posted a link to an article by Ben Tongue that may be of interest: http://www.bentongue.com/xtalset/29MxQFL/29MxQFL.html I call your attention to Table 2. 73, Jim, KR1S http://qrp.kearman.com/
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